Phil Gardner grew up in the north west town of Werris Creek, outside Tamworth.
Now, he's the Chief Executive Officer of the Newcastle Knights.
An accountant by trade, he readily admits he's not who people want doing the books.
Rather, the boy from Werris Creek said his degree helped him develop the leadership skills he needed to run Wests Group and to eventually take up what was then a failing club reeling from the turmoil of the now infamous Tinkler era.
In a new and revealing interview with host Barry Toohey, for Toohey's News: The Podcast, Gardner opens up on the challenges that faced the club in the early days of his tenure, and the highs and lows that followed, from the celebrated signing of young wunderkind Kalyn Ponga, to the controversial ousting of former coach Nathan Brown.
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Toohey will bring a new episode to all your favourite podcasting apps every week, complementing his premium and exclusive Knights reporting and analysis, for ACM pubication the Newcastle Herald.
Episode 31 of Toohey's News will publish next week.